作者：深鏈財經 / 來源：資訊
4月7日下午3點，XELS的創始人、CEO Takeshi Nojima和COO Mitchell Hammer做客深鏈財經線上沙龍，圍繞“減少碳足跡，降低碳排放，XELS如何打造環境友好的數字解決方案？”主題進行分享。以下為分享實錄，深鏈財經整理。
嘉賓介紹
Takeshi Nojima：大家好，我是Takeshi Nojima，目前我在這個反全球變暖項目上已經工作了好幾年，在此之前我有超過10年的軟件開發經驗。
Mitch Hammer：大家好，我是Mitch，主要負責業務發展、運營和戰略。主要包括確定投資機會所在的戰略區域，并滿足主要利益相關者的要求。我還負責領導和組織與團隊和社區成員的每周會議，討論我們的經濟和激勵模式、代幣經濟、時間表、運營和執行戰略的所有方面。在此之前，我在東京的一些初創公司工作，以及之前在迪拜的澳大利亞貿易和投資委員會工作過。
分享環節
深鏈財經：請跟大家先介紹下首先，XELS是什么項目呢？First, what is XELS?
Hammer：XELS是一個具有生態意識的區塊鏈平臺，使企業和個人都能夠通過購買代幣化的碳中和信用額，輕松透明地抵消他們的碳足跡。
XELS is an eco-conscious blockchain platform enabling corporations and individuals alike the ability to easily and transparently offset their carbon footprint by purchasing tokenized carbon offset credits.
深鏈財經：請簡單介紹下XELS要解決的問題是什么？What's the problem that your start-up is trying to solve?
Hammer：XELS的核心目標是促進一個更綠色、更健康的地球。我們正在通過提高碳補償市場的參與度和透明度來實現這一目標。碳市場是復雜的，標準可以有很大的不同，但通常有兩種主要的信用:“合規”信用受到總量控制和交易系統的嚴格監管。“自愿”信用對任何人都是可用的，并且很受那些想向消費者表明他們對解決氣候變化問題是認真的公司的歡迎。它們也對那些想減少碳足跡并簡單地按自然規律行事的人有吸引力。我們最初的重點是促進后者的使用，同時保護個人和企業免受欺詐。
The core goal of XELS is to promote a greener, healthier planet. We’re working toward that by increasing both participation and transparency in carbon offset markets. Carbon markets are complex and standards can vary wildly, but generally there are two main kinds of credits: “compliance” credits are heavily regulated and required under cap and trade systems. “Voluntary” credits are available to anyone, and are popular with companies who want to show consumers they are serious about tackling climate change. They are also attractive to individuals who want to decrease their carbon footprint and simply do right by nature. We are initially focused on boosting access to the latter, while also protecting people and businesses from fraud.
自從《京都議定書》和《巴黎協定》簽訂后碳補償市場誕生以來，欺詐一直是一個嚴重的問題。 眾所周知，心懷不軌的人會出售虛假或已過期的碳信用額，而信用“回收”欺詐可能導致未退休的碳信用額增加一倍的支出（參見此處，一個對碳信用證帶來最大打擊的欺詐案件，這個案件甚至使德意志銀行陷入困境） 銀行：https：//www.cityam.com/tax-scammers-and-carbon-credits-decade/）。 區塊鏈的分布式分類帳技術是碳信用額度的完美用例，因為它無法更改，撤銷或重復使用。 數字資產以及交易哈希值也可以被“燒掉”，該交易哈希值可以證明相關的信用額度已永久取消。 我們最初將推出同名的XELS代幣作為“平臺代幣”，以訪問將來與一組行業標準的自愿性碳中和信用掛鉤的1：1穩定代幣–可以將其視為碳信用的“USDT”。
Since the birth of carbon offset markets in the wake of the Kyoto and Paris agreements, fraud has been a serious problem. Bad actors have been known to sell fake or expired carbon credits, and credit “recycling” fraud can lead to double spending of unretired carbon credits (see here for an example of one of the biggest fraud cases to hit carbon credits, which even ensnared Deutsche Bank: https://www.cityam.com/tax-scammers-and-carbon-credits-decade/). Blockchain’s distributed ledger technology is the perfect use case for carbon credits, as it cannot be changed, reversed, or double spent. Digital assets can also be “burned,” along with a transaction hash that proves the associated credit has been retired forever. We’re initially launching the eponymous XELS token as a “platform token” to access a future suite of stable tokens pegged 1:1 to various industry-standard voluntary carbon offset credits – think of those as being the “USDT” of carbon credits.
深鏈財經：可以給我們介紹下XELS的目標客戶是哪些人？Who is your target customer?
Hammer：從個人到最大的全球性公司，任何人都可以參與碳補償。碳補償現在已成為亞馬遜，微軟和耐克等公司的主要目標，它們不再對等待政府牽頭感興趣。 他們已經著手主動消除當前的碳足跡，甚至是整個歷史足跡。 特別是零售品牌一直在推行綠色舉措，例如使用由再生塑料制成的面料，因為消費者越來越要求它們應對氣候變化。 讓公司輕松透明地抵消其碳排放而又不必擔心被騙，將使他們更加愿意加入這場戰斗，并且只要消費者相信他們有意為環境做出改變，就會產生紅利。 當然，想要抵消碳排放的普通人也可以參與其中-該平臺向所有人開放。
Carbon offsetting is now a major goal of companies like Amazon, Microsoft and Nike, who are no longer interested in waiting around for governments to take the lead. They’ve set out to neutralize their current carbon footprint, or even their entire historical footprint, by their own initiative. Retail brands in particular have been pushing green initiatives, such as using fabrics made from recycled plastics, because consumers are increasingly demanding that they address climate change. Making it easy for companies to transparently offset their carbon without fear of fraud will make them even more willing to enter the fray, and it will pay dividends as far as consumer trust that they are intent on making a difference for the environment. And of course, normal people who want to offset their carbon can also get involved – the platform is open to all.
深鏈財經：可以簡單向我們介紹下為什么選擇在現在這個時間點啟動？Why is this the right time to do your startup？
Hammer：根據世界銀行的數據，人類通過購買和退還碳信用額僅能補償全球排放量的22％，然而，運營受管制的碳市場的國家的比例已從2016年的40％上升至2020年的70％。需求壁壘可能遠遠超過了新的碳信用額的發放，這受到了碳項目認證緩慢而昂貴的過程的限制。 由于欺詐已經是一個現實存在的問題，重要的是要有一個更好的平臺來滿足對碳補償的日益增長的需求，從而更好地保護那些想通過首先投資碳補償來做正確的事情的實體。 氣候危機非常嚴峻但可悲的是，“正確的時機”已經過去了很長時間，我們希望XELS能夠增加參與度使我們走上通往碳中和的更好道路。
According to the World Bank, humanity compensates for just 22% of global emissions through the purchase and retirement of carbon credits, and yet the proportion of countries operating regulated carbon markets has risen from 40% in 2016 to 70% in 2020. The result is a wall of demand that may far outstrip the issuance of new carbon credits, which is constrained by the slow and expensive process of carbon project certification. Since fraud is already an existing issue, it’s important that the increased demand for carbon offsets is met with a better platform to protect those entities that want to do the right thing by investing in carbon offsets in the first place. The climate crisis is dire – sadly the “right time” has already long passed, but we hope that XELS will increase participation and get us on a better path toward carbon neutrality.
深鏈財經：其實目前市面上也已經有一些類似的項目，與XELS類似的公司有哪些？XELS與這些公司有什么不同？What are the major comparable companies that have a similar solution as yours? How's your startup different from these players?
Hammer：區塊鏈碳市場的許多“基礎設施”項目都已經失敗——很少有人采用信用代幣化方法。Aircarbon是一家提供交易平臺的公司，但你必須是一個合格的投資者(因此，普通人不得參與)。波塞冬是另一個與IBM合作的公司，但我看不到他們公開發布了任何東西。他們似乎專注于抵消銷售點，有點像你在商店買東西時的自愿稅。Nori使用區塊鏈來驗證清除操作，但未啟用信用購買。我我認為我們的平臺以及用于碳信用額度方法的“穩定幣”使我們在該領域獨樹一幟。
There are a number of blockchain “infrastructure” plays for carbon markets that have folded - few others are taking the credit tokenization approach. Aircarbon is one that offers an exchange, but you must be an accredited investor (thus normal folks are barred from participation). Poseidon is another that was working with IBM, but I can’t see that they have released anything publicly. They appear to be focused on offsetting at point of sale, kind of like a voluntary tax when you buy something at a shop. Nori uses blockchain to verify removals, but doesn’t enable credit purchase. I think our platform plus “stable coin” for carbon credit approach makes us unique in the space.
雖然不是對這個問題的直接回答，但我也想提一下我們與典型的“加密”玩家的區別，因為這個領域經常因為浪費能源而受到批評。雖然XELS打算在以太區塊鏈上公開發布，但我們非常清楚與現有DLT基礎設施相關的高能耗問題。為了“身體力行”，XELS將在不久的將來遷移到專有的低能耗區塊鏈。XELS鏈采用混合權益證明(想想Etherum)和工作量證明(想想比特幣)的方法，使用戶可以在標準筆記本電腦上運行它，而不需要耗電的高性能GPU礦機。
While not a direct response to this question, I also wanted to mention how we differentiate from typical “crypto” players, when the space is often criticized for its wasteful energy use. While XELS intends to launch publicly on the Ethereum blockchain, we are very cognizant of concerns over high energy consumption associated with existing DLT infrastructure. In order to “practice what we preach,” XELS will migrate to a proprietary low-energy blockchain in the near future. The XELS Chain takes a hybrid proof-of-stake (think Ethereum) and proof-of-work (think Bitcoin) approach, enabling users to run it on a standard laptop without the need for electricity-hungry mining rigs with high-powered GPUs.
深鏈財經：XELS的收入模式是怎樣的？What's your revenue model?
Hammer：對于我們平臺上發生的每一筆交易，XELS都會收取一小筆傭金。在不透露機密信息(仍在保密協議下)的情況下，我們可以說，我們正在與日本5家主要上市公司進行深入談判，這些公司雖然不是政府要求的，但有興趣使用XELS自愿抵消他們的碳足跡。
For each transaction that occurs on our platform, XELS takes a small commission. Without revealing confidential information (still under NDA), we can say that we’re in advanced discussions with 5 major listed companies here in Japan that while not required by the government, are interested in using XELS to voluntarily offset their carbon footprints.
其中一家公司明確表示了每年抵消200,000噸二氧化碳的意圖-這相當于43000多輛汽車行駛一年，或近34,000個家庭的年用電量二氧化碳排放的總量。詳情可查閱網址：https://www.epa.gov/energy/greenhouse-gas-equivalencies-calculator).自愿碳信用額度的成本各不相同，但平均每個信用額度約為10美元，一個信用額度相當于1噸二氧化碳-這將是200萬美元的投資，或者如果所有五家公司都決定抵消類似的金額，大約是1000萬美元。我們會從這個數字中抽取一定比例。我們將在本月晚些時候會見另外20家上市公司的聯盟，并打算與它們簽署諒解備忘錄。
One of them has specifically expressed the intention of offsetting 200,000 tonnes of CO2 per year – that’s equivalent to more than 43,000 cars being driven for a year, or nearly 34,000 households’ combined annual electricity usage (https://www.epa.gov/energy/greenhouse-gas-equivalencies-calculator). Voluntary carbon credits vary in cost, but average around $10 per credit, with one credit being equal to 1 tonne of CO2 - that would be a $2 million investment, or roughly $10 million if all five companies decide to offset a similar amount. We’d capture a percentage of that amount. We’re meeting a coalition of 20 additional listed companies later this month, and have every intention of signing MOUs with them.
鏈上期權還有一個痛點就是操作難度太高，分為鏈上交易的難度以及金融產品設計的復雜度兩個部分。之前像Uniswap，Sushiswap等去中心化交易平臺其實已經很好地教育市場了，大家逐漸習慣錢包交易的流程，市場也出現了一些更便于操作的聚合平臺。而金融產品設計的復雜度，我們Seaweed已經進行了很大程度的精進，比如UI的極致優化，以及期權的簡化，使用戶一目了然，不需要浪費太多時間去找功能和理解繁雜的表格。當然未來還有很多空間我們可以去做，結合DeFi的本質，我們可以上線更多有趣的資產，比如說優化，比如說農作物商品大宗商品，這都是可以在鏈上實現的。
深鏈財經：XELS計劃如何在競爭中立足于行業？How do you plan to defend your startup against competition?
Hammer：我們并不認為這一領域的任何人都是競爭對手，更多的是將其視為共同目標而戰的盟友。這一領域的每個參與者都在研究略有不同的解決方案，我們嘗試以任何可能的方式進行協作。然而，幾乎所有這些項目都是在非常耗電的以太區塊鏈上開發的。我們希望吸引組織和開發者轉向XELS鏈，在我們定制的低能耗基礎設施上開發他們自己的解決方案。
We don’t really see anyone in this space as competition, more as allies fighting toward a common goal. Each player in this field is working on a slightly different solution and we try collaborate in anyway possible. However, almost all of these projects are developing on the Ethereum blockchain which is very power hungry. We hope to attract organisations and developers to switch over to XELS Chain and develop their own solutions on our bespoke, low-energy infrastructure.
深鏈財經：目前這個市場的機會有多大？How big is the market opportunity?
Hammer：我們最初的重點是希望成為天然碳的日本公司。 日本的清潔能源計劃落后英國50％，因此潛力巨大。 我們支持首相須秀吉英（Hoshihide Suga）的目標，即到2050年實現凈零排放，這是所有日本大型企業都希望加入的計劃，我們最初的重點是希望成為天然碳的日本公司。
Our initial focus is on Japanese companies looking to go carbon natural. Japanese clean energy initiatives lag the UK by 50%, so the potential is massive. We’re supporting Prime Minister Yoshihide Suga’s target of reaching net zero emissions by 2050, which is something all big Japanese companies will want to get on board with or face backlash from the government and consumers alike.
日本的清潔能源計劃落后英國50％，因此潛力巨大。 我們支持首相須秀吉英（Hoshihide Suga）的目標，即到2050年實現凈零排放，這是所有日本大型企業都希望加入的計劃否則將面臨政府和消費者的強烈反對。在我們了解到的公司中，有三分之二有長期減排目標，或將在今年年底前實現。如上所述，每年20萬噸的適度碳抵消目標相當于每家公司約200萬美元的投資-僅日本就有3700多家公司在東京證券交易平臺上市。來自利益相關者-包括消費者和投資者-的壓力將是自愿減排行動的主要驅動力，XELS準備支持任何想要走向綠色的公司或個人。
Two thirds of companies we have apprised have a long-term emissions reduction goal or will have one by the end of this year. As mentioned above, a modest carbon offset goal of 200,000 tonnes per year is equivalent to about $2 million in investment per company – and Japan alone has over 3,700 companies listed on the Tokyo Stock Exchange.Pressure from stakeholders - both consumers and investors – will be the main driver of voluntary carbon reduction action, and XELS is ready to support any company or individual wanting to go green.
深鏈財經：XELS的代幣分發計劃是怎樣的？Last question, what's your token distribution strategy?
Hammer：我們公司尋求為全球用戶群提供合規和自愿信用，從后者開始。 XELS代幣將通過數字資產交易平臺向公眾開放，從而使公司和個人都可以透明地減少其碳足跡。
The company seeks to offer both compliance and voluntary credits to a worldwide user base — starting with the latter. XELS tokens will be made available to the public via digital asset exchanges, allowing both corporations and individuals to transparently reduce their carbon footprints.
這還不是公開的消息，但我們將于4月8日上線并在明天10點JST時間公布上線平臺，這將成為個人和公司能夠購買XELS令牌的第一個平臺。
This is not public knowledge yet, but we’re listing on April 8 and will annouce what platform tomorrow at 10am JST– which will become the first platform by which individuals and companies will be able to purchase XELS tokens.
